Dr. Dan Plews (00:00)
Adam Story, how have you recovered from your deadly dozen at the weekend?
Adam Storey (00:05)
Honestly, mate, battling. And it it's it's almost I know, I was just gonna say it's a little bit embarrassing to say because it was three three runs and four hundred meter runs and three stations. But man, it's it's interesting like how much you can hurt yourself on such a short amount of exercise,
Dr. Dan Plews (00:07)
Battling, you only did the relay.
Yeah, do do you wanna explain to people what the Deadly Dozen is? Because reckon many people who are listening to this might not even know what it entails. I guess it's quite hard to remember all the stations, so you don't have to say them in the exact order.
Adam Storey (00:37)
Yeah, no, thank goodness. yeah, and I'm gonna I'm gonna talk about it as if I'm an experienced veteran, but it was literally my first hit out on the weekend. yeah, really, really great competition. Like it's I believe it it or originated over in the UK. And you're looking at basically 12 400 meter runs around an athletics track, so that's always fun getting outdoors. And much like hyrox in between or interspersed with those runs, you've got 12 stations.
Dr. Dan Plews (00:45)
Yeah.
Adam Storey (01:07)
Now, the main difference I guess, from Hyrox is Hyrox, you've got some quite equipment-heavy stations, being the ergs, sleds, and that kind of stuff. Whereas Deadly doesn't, they really market it on the fact that it's really accessible. A lot of the stations are bodyweight-based exercises. So, say, for example, they've got your classic burpee board jumps, but they've got things like bear crawl. all the other stations are using things like kettlebells, dumbbells, or a weight plate.
yeah. So for me, man, like as you mentioned, we did a a mixed relay team of four of us, two men, two women, which meant that we had to do each three runs in three stations. And you get to much like again, Hyrox pick and choose which stations you're gonna gonna do. so for me, I actually had to start start our relay. So I did a 400 meter effort and then went straight into the farmer's carry. So
Similar to Hyrox Hyrox you got 24 kilo kettlebells for 200 meters. So this was 24 kilo kettlebells for 240 meters. and then tagged on to my partner. the next station that I had to do again from memory was the kettlebell goblet squats, which was an absolute quad destruction. So it's sixty reps.
Dr. Dan Plews (02:22)
it's surprisingly hard the the goblet squats. it's funny because when I did I mean I've done it I've done a few singles. Actually I actually has have the world record for the forty plus. Did you know that? For the deadly dozen? Just so you know, if if you're asking. but it made me realise that when it comes to war balls, it's not my legs that are the problem because I can do the goblet squats pretty easy. But push press, I am hopeless. The push press I was just I just
Adam Storey (02:35)
There you go.
Yeah.
Really?
Dr. Dan Plews (02:51)
I just get reamed in the push press. It's just ridiculous. Can't do it. look my little spaghetti arms won't g won' won't go for it, but it it's a it's it's a lot of reps though. Sixty reps is a lot.
Adam Storey (03:03)
It is, yeah. So I'm I'm probably the opposite to you, mate. just during my fiber type, I knew that I was gonna get a full lactate flush and a full destruction on the quads, which I did on the goblet squat. yeah, so 60 reps is a killer. And then and then clean and press to finish with the fifteen kilo plate. So again, sixty reps of that. And yeah, it was Oceania Champs, which was extra special for us. So we ended up not only winning our age category, we won overall for the mixed relay at Oceania.
Dr. Dan Plews (03:14)
Th then you did clean and press, didn't you? Clean and press.
Did you win the relay overall,
did you?
Adam Storey (03:34)
Over overall, man. Yeah. So we were stoked. She got a bit of prize prize money. No, one overall. And yeah, again, the other amazing thing that we were stoked about is we we set an an age group world record for it. We actually broke it by two minutes and forty seven seconds, broke the world record. So yeah, it was it was fun, man. But
Dr. Dan Plews (03:37)
I didn't know that. I thought he just won the ice group.
What a sender. How hard
Adam Storey (04:00)
yeah, again, I I I said to my son Cully, I said, man, I've got to be smart about this because I can probably put myself into a pretty bad hole after four hundred meters. So it wasn't it wasn't too bad. I think I I did it what did I run it at? I think it was like seventy seventy five seconds, I think. Well seven seventy seconds and then and then straight into the farmer's carry, but yeah, just did not wanna be stupid out of the out of the gate.
Dr. Dan Plews (04:19)
yeah. Okay.
When I did that when
I did when I did the relay at the Deadly Dozen, I did the singles in the morning, then I did the relay in the afternoon and I got absolutely destroyed on that first four hundred by some well you well as we established last week, I can't run on my tongue, can I, so
So I was d all only dependent on my on my slow twitch fibers fibers. I couldn't pull out the the one fast twitch. So but it was it's good the way. They're good events, they're great training races. Great training races.
Adam Storey (04:50)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah. No, it was that was
I was I was gonna say, mate, they're they're great training races. Like we had a lot of our Hyrox crew there. had one of our our athletes, Alyssa Goodwin, who's who's charging head to Stockholm for Hyrox World Champs. She was in our relay team as well. So again it's it's a really great training crossover again, just again that sort of competition environment as well, which was fun.
Dr. Dan Plews (05:20)
it was you, Alyssa, Heath and Kes, right? We're also a a couple of weapons. So I mean it's a good it's a good team. It's an old no offense, everyone. Older team, but it's a very it's a very good team. It's like a I mean, you're all talking like all of like, you know, go getters and flag winners and everything like that. So that's cool. Yeah, how good.
Adam Storey (05:23)
Yeah, that's right.
Experienced
word you're looking for, closy, not old, experienced.
Dr. Dan Plews (05:44)
Experience an experienced team. Well you well actually you're not experienced because you just said you've only ever done one. So but you talk about you talk it like you are experienced. but yeah, also at the weekend we had Hong Kong Hyrox which is good. And we had the man Dan Hoy, fifty seven forty, which is which puts him the not the third fastest time for a New Zealander, but the third fastest New Zealander.
Adam Storey (05:49)
Okay.
Yeah, that's right. That's right.
We did.
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (06:13)
So I think behind Bow Wheels and Big the Big Dex man, which is a big step in the right direction. I started coaching Dan twelve weeks ago now. So, you know, you you're coming into I think the training's starting to come through and he started we was like a one one, so it's like a big a big four minute PB for him. and good stepping stone towards the world champs and like he's just scratching the surface and
Adam Storey (06:14)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (06:41)
Yeah, I think he shocked a few people actually.
Adam Storey (06:44)
Yeah, well it it's very, very concerning and alarming in a good way when, you know, a person that does fifty seven minutes is only scratching the surface. So do you wanna give the viewers bit of a bit of a background sort of story about Dan Hoy, where he's come from and and you know what what you see our strengths and weak strengths are?
Dr. Dan Plews (07:04)
so Dan Dan's from a triathlon background. is very good as a junior and junior and youth. I think he won the wo the youth Olympics actually. He won the youth Olympics in triathlon. So it's very good, very good, strong aerobic background, a lot of training, but fall out of fell out of love with triathlon and basically took up Hyrox and I started coaching him twelve weeks ago. He was just coaching himself and and
You know, I said to I said two of him 'cause he came around to my house and we had a bit of a chat before I coached him just to see how things could work. And one of the things I said to him is like tentative has no power. You know, he was just he was doing high rots, but he was very tentative and he wasn't really giving it his all. So, that was one so, you know, he just a little bit more focus and a little bit more programming made a big difference. And
And also I said to him, like, 'cause we we raced a couple of times and I beaten him twice and I went through all his numbers. And I said to him, There's no way that you should be I should be anywhere near what you can do. And I knew it at the time. So I could see just from talking to him about what he's done in the past, some of his like some of his like some of his just his numbers of terms of what he can do in training. I was like, Yeah, you should nowhere be you should be nowhere near the times that you're doing
Adam Storey (08:09)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (08:23)
So I knew immediately that there was at least four or five minutes that's gonna come off him quite quickly. but it really, you know, we c we've kept things quite light. I don't think we've even tapped the surface with his running. I think he's close to a sub eight minutes three K in his heyday. So that'll Yeah. So that's pretty scary, right? And I mean it's heavier now. That was when he was in, you know, he's he's in the eighty kilos now. So obviously he was pure runner then, but still it it talks to how big his engine is.
Adam Storey (08:38)
Oof. Jeez.
Dr. Dan Plews (08:52)
it's just a c question of getting some of the stations right. But at the moment we've taken the in all the races that he's done, we've taken the approach of really holding back on the runs and using them as cruising to get through the stations. So once we once he gets better at the stations and he can start running a bit faster, I think he's still at the fastest run of the day, regardless. you know, and we've not you know, we're really just doing one one hard run a week at the moment and then a compromise run and a tempo run. yeah.
Adam Storey (09:11)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (09:21)
Tempo running is something that something that Hyrox athletes seem to not do. And it's such a big thing. And I look at it like triathlon, we do a lot of tempo running because it's a strength dominant, you know, it's longer, it's very extensive endurance, it's running running well when you're fatigued. And it's such a component that no no no Hyrox athletes do, no higher ex athletes talk about. I had a I had a meeting with big Dexter Buchanan.
Adam Storey (09:29)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (09:49)
earlier in the week. And one of the things I was saying to him is I was trying to encourage him to do include a bit more tempo running in his build-up to to Stockholm. And for those who don't know what tempo running is, tempo running is anything that sits between that basically sits between LT1 and LT2. So we classify it in the heavy, heavy exercise domain. So it can be basically it's around your half marathon pace, G-marathon pace in that sort of area. Most people never go there because they see it as level three, but it's actually
Adam Storey (09:58)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (10:18)
bread and butter of a lot of a lot of good run programs and like for Iron Man I would almost exclusively do running in tempo and never do any threshold or Vo2 Max until I was just coming up closer to the to racing. So
Adam Storey (10:34)
Wow, I've got so many questions here for you, Plewsy Where do I start? remind me to circle back to Dan Dan. I've got some questions around him. But firstly, just for some some viewers, so you've touched upon like it is it is that zone three, which people nowadays tend to like really. They've they've got this heightened awareness around zone three due to all the fact of polarized training coming out. So two two part question, my friend.
firstly, would you mind giving the the listeners bit of a an example of a classic tempo session that you'd love to roll out or that you love to roll out, sorry. and the second part is just given the fact that it is in that zone three, what what are some considerations that you also have with athletes, you know, following a tempo session or leading into a tempo session?
Dr. Dan Plews (11:22)
Yeah, I mean th so a typical a typical tempo session is we do classify it as like extensive endurance. So it means it's like a l it's a little bit harder, but it's not but it's therefore it's a little bit longer. 'Cause I talked about last week. There's no such thing as hard without intensity and duration. Like, you know, it's really it's hard to run a four hundred meters, it's hard to run a hundred kilometres. It's all about the the duration, the duration and the intensity together, even though they're very different.
So because it's a little bit slower, you're going a little bit longer. And that means that typically you'd be accumulating, we talk about pure threshold, we're typically accumulating like thirty minutes of work at threshold when we're doing a training session. You know, if we're getting up to 40, that's pretty big. That's a pretty big session. Like, you know, it's pretty hefty. But with tempo, you can be forty five minutes to an hour, maybe more than an hour of tempo. So like a a very typical, a longer session.
Adam Storey (12:08)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (12:18)
I just gave this one of my triathletes for example, would be three by five K. that's a big one. That's a big that's a big hearty one. And you just descend. So basically you you start at your LT1. So like your marathon pace and you and you go down, you do marathon pace, in between marathon and half marathon pace, then the last one will be at your half marathon pace, and that would be a real hearty one. Four by three K would be a typical one. but it's it's longer, right? So you're talking like there's 12K, 15k, that sort of sessions. If you and if you're
that's but you can also do that based on time right you could do four by four by ten minutes or sorry not be a bit that'll be a bit short but something like you know four by fifteen minutes or something like that you know just a bit longer so we're going towards more closer to 50 minutes to an hour. another really great session that I like to do is with the tempo is it's a it can be with break so it's a straight 10k
Adam Storey (13:05)
Yeah, yeah. Amazing. And so
Dr. Dan Plews (13:16)
where you go one K, two K, three K, four K, or you go you can go the opposite way round where you go four, three, two, one, but you basically start at your marathon pace and descend closer to your threshold. So you go four K marathon pace and you drop off ten seconds per K, then drop off ten seconds per K. I think I've I think I've done that with you before, haven't I?
Adam Storey (13:31)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mate, you read my mind. I was just gonna say what this was back when you and I were with Emirates Team New Zealand and we did a a morning training session at it was Les Mills and the City Man and it was we did that exact treadmill session, four three, two one, and it absolutely destroyed me, mate. Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (13:45)
Yeah. Great session. It's a great
it's a great session. And it's actually it can be done both ways because at one way you're teaching yourself to run like you can go run fast with fatigue because you've come from four K, three K, two K, but you can also go one K, start fast and then go to slower. it's both both work well actually. So
Adam Storey (14:03)
Yes.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I I I still routinely include that session and and all my build ups actually the the four through two one. It's a it's a goodie. yeah, and then just going back to the I guess heart rate considerations and overall load monitoring considerations, because again, like clocking up those zone three minutes can be relatively easy to do. So I guess for from an athlete point of view, are there any like key considerations that you'd be mindful of?
Dr. Dan Plews (14:28)
Yeah. The I mean the the the one of the key considerations when it comes to not not when it I'm actually gonna before I talk about recovery, the main thing that we want to consider though is diversity within our training weeks as well. And I think that's one thing that we often lose sight of a little bit is that when you look at a training plan, you w you don't want it be you don't want it to be too monotonous and you wanna be targeting different aspects of your physiology, right? So you want a bit of speed, you know, maybe a few strides, you want
Adam Storey (14:56)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (14:58)
bit of threshold and then you want a bit of tempo or VO2 max or you know, you could do double you could do two threshold sessions, however you want to be, but you do want diversity and and you you want to move that around with the training program. So it's not like you just do tempo all the time and threshold all the time. You kind of look I look at a program and look okay what's what's missing in the context of what the athlete needs, right? Where, you know, and that's based on background individualization and all that kind of thing. But
Adam Storey (15:22)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (15:27)
But yeah, they are they can be the the trap you can fall into with I think with tempo is that it can f you have to just make sure that your level two running is easy. Easier, I think, because otherwise you can if you're doing because a tempo running can often sit quite close to the top of your L two for a lot of it. You can be running quite fast. So you know, you want to make sure that if you are doing more tempo running, you want to have a bit of a gap between
w how fast you're running for your level two and how fast you're running for your level level three. but also also you y you have to respect it like you would respect a a threshold session because it's of similar I would say the the load, if we measure it in terms of training load, it would actually come out to be quite similar because the duration is longer. So you you respect the same type of recovery. Even though the autonomic s nervous system stress may be slightly less, the muscular tra muscular load will be
Adam Storey (15:58)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (16:24)
the same or may could be even slightly longer depending depending on what what happens. But you know, this is one of the things about all these contexts, because you can compare threshold to VO2 max to tempo. And you can make either of those sessions harder or easier. So we published a paper, Anna Holt was one of my master's students and we published a paper that was that looked at the recovery between VO2 max versus threshold sessions and short interval training sessions.
Adam Storey (16:28)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (16:53)
And just to talk about, I'm not going to talk about the short interval training sessions, but to compare VO2 max to threshold, the threshold training took way longer to recover from than the VO2 match training session. Way longer. And it was like sub it was like substantially longer. And the reason it reason happened is because they had they maintained so much so much longer time at threshold and slightly above, whereas even for the VO2 match, yes, they were above it, but it wasn't for that long. But it was because of what the session was.
Adam Storey (17:04)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (17:23)
So the VO2 match session was six by three minutes. The threshold session was five by ten minutes. So they're quite, you're talking quite an easy VO2 match session versus quite a hard threshold session. So you can't just say, the juice isn't worth the squeeze when it comes to VO2 match training, because a six by three minute session is actually a decent VO2 match session. A five by ten minute threshold session is a very hefty threshold session. So it's all about how you're balancing that when you're deciding how you're gonna
Adam Storey (17:26)
Yes.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (17:53)
how you're gonna put where you're gonna put your week and and who that and who the individual athlete is.
Adam Storey (17:58)
Yeah. I mean that that's such a great a great sound bite and segue there, Plewsy So I guess, you know, what what would be your recommendations? There's a lot of focus on threshold training and obviously zone two training within the Hyrox space from from coaches and athletes. But you know, what would be your recommendations around sort of balancing the the the integration of VO two max and into that that training cycle? yeah, keen to hear your thoughts on that.
Dr. Dan Plews (18:24)
Yeah, well, I guess again, let's let's just identify what VO2 match and threshold of training is. I think that's always a a good starting point. I mean, in exercise physiology, I mean we've done a lot of papers recently on measuring durability and and things like this. And in exercise physiology, we typically we demark training intensity distribution between moderate, heavy, and severe. So you have moderate, the transition between moderate and heavy, which is like your that would be your
Adam Storey (18:51)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Dan Plews (18:53)
Lt one, so your aerobic threshold, which is closer to what you do in an Iron Man or closer to some people's marathon pacing, not if you're doing it under two hours, obviously. But you know, someone who's taking a normal amount of time would be closer to that. And then you're talking from the heavy to severe. And the heavy to severe threshold where you go past those t exercise intensity domains is classified as threshold. And that's what people typically call as as threshold intensity. And to
To differentiate those, so in the moderate intensity, if we were to measure lactate or yeah, if we were to measure lactate, for example, it wouldn't really rise. It would be very stable and it would just it would be at rest, it would be two, one, one, one and a half. It might go to two or less than two, and it'd just stay there. But you're still exercising and you still have a reasonable breathing rate. When you go from moderate to heavy, what happens is now lactate will jump up, maybe to three, three and a half, and it will.
Also stay there, maybe gradually rise. When you go from heavy to severe, that demarcation, there, that at that point you get another jumping lactate, but you'd have no steady state. So the that threshold is what we call we call it meta it's like a quasi-metabolic steady state, right? So that's the point where you lose your quasi-steady state. Because it's I say quasi because it's not fully steady state, because even below the threshold, you still get a bit of a rise in your VO2 over time, and you're rising your
Adam Storey (20:03)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (20:22)
your effort over time. But once you get past that threshold, you have no stability anymore. And you will just see lactates and your VO2 rise super quick. And that break point is what we call threshold training. So we're trying to get right on that break point of quasi physiological steady state. we call it the maximal metabolic steady state in some of our in some of the research. there's loads of different terms for it. But that's what it essentially what it is. and
Adam Storey (20:27)
Well.
Dr. Dan Plews (20:51)
Yeah, and and what's really interesting is that you know there's a lot of talk around threshold versus VO2 VO2 max. And it's been it's been debated for centuries. And it all goes back to polarized training. And we all talk about polarized training, and I think everyone agrees that polarized training is a good way to train. But the bit thing about polarized training is it explicitly does not include threshold training. Because most of the studies, the Sealer, the Stogel, they compare
Adam Storey (21:08)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (21:17)
Polarized training to threshold training. So they they have the groups that either do the like more of a eighty twenty split where eighty percent of the training is at a low intensity and then twenty percent is at a VO2 max type intensity, or it's kind of more of a a split, like you know, sixty forty, fifty fifty threshold threshold VO2 max. So and in those studies, polarized training is always on top. So training more at your VO2 max is always better.
Adam Storey (21:36)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (21:47)
It's always seems to have better improvements in in the individuals. But that's not to say that there's not therefore room, right? But now people you can say, okay, but what happens if I do eighty percent of my training at a low intensity and twenty percent of my training at threshold? You know, so that now you you kind of like there's a bit of push and a bit of pull, a bit of drag of where how you take the program in terms of in terms of those factors, because it's not necessarily no one's gonna be doing fifty fifty or you or even sixty forty, which is kind of your pyramidal.
training intensive distribution, which is also seemed to be effective. but it's how how you balance the the three. And at the end of the day, it's you're using a combination of all of those things to pull together a program that's demand driven.
Adam Storey (22:31)
Yeah, yeah. It's fascinating, You've got so many different levers that you need to pull on. and I know last week we we touched upon a a paper which discussed, I guess, differences in fiber types so and how that can affect a person's recover recoverability, you know, between sessions. slow twitch dominant athletes, you know, rapid recovery versus fast twitch, you you're looking at a five hour kind of depression of of neuromuscular function.
So I guess with your your prescription with regards to threshold and VO two, like what what considerations are you bearing in mind like when you're looking at different athletes?
Dr. Dan Plews (23:03)
Yeah, so typically what you what you do find is it's dep a lot of dependent on background. Like so someone like if I first think I'd go back to Dan Hoy because we were talking about him b before, like I know for a fact that as soon as I give him VO2 math sessions, he's gonna respond really quick and he's gonna get a big a big boost from doing that. Because what's clear in the literature is that it's it's very stimulus dependent, right? And the more and the more
Adam Storey (23:30)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (23:33)
You know, what how can I say this? The the stronger your training background, the bigger the stimulus to get the response. Like and so you can either you can either do more and more threshold volume or you can increase the intensity. And there'll be a point on where the threshold volume is gonna stagnate and you can't push it anymore because one is you're just gonna be doing stupid amounts of tr threshold volume, which is gonna increase your injury risk.
Adam Storey (23:38)
Mm.
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (23:58)
And you're just gonna go nowhere. So you have to add in some extra intensity to try and push the extra stimulus. And that's what's been very clear in that very strong endurance background athletes will eventually have to intro introduce and I would recommend they introduce a bit of VO2 match training in the lead up to to a race. And even with the running economy data, you'll see huge improvements in people's running economy when they do more VO2 max training as well, because of the the increases in efficiency when they go back to threshold.
Adam Storey (24:22)
Mm.
Hmm. Yeah. I mean it's fascinating. I mean you you often your your famous catchphrase, which you say time and time again, is that didn't even touch the sides. I assume when you say it didn't even touch the sides, you're referring about your training load, but who knows? That's open to question. Yeah, yeah. no that that is that is really fascinating to to hear about. And especially like there'll be so many different listeners at the moment, you know, just trying to sort of understand like where can I where can I best
Dr. Dan Plews (24:37)
Yeah.
Open to debate.
Adam Storey (24:57)
you know, utilise VO two VO two training and this this threshold. So that was cool.
Dr. Dan Plews (25:02)
Yeah,
but but but the thing is is I think also is that like d people shouldn't be scared of VO2 match training. Like that's what I want to bring across to the listeners is that I think like a lot of coaches, they they almost scaremonger people from doing VO2 match training because there's a big injury risk or a big like recovery recovery risk or you're not gonna recover as fast. But like what what I want to say is that you know a g you know, Gordon Walker he says to he said to me is that
Adam Storey (25:17)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (25:32)
You know, his famous saying is a good session and a bad session look the same on paper, right? In that the session in itself, just because it says threshold or it says VO2 max, you cannot automatically assume that the threshold session is easier and takes long less time to recover from than the VO2 max. Because you can build a session in any way to make it harder or easier. And it's all about the stimulus and variety. So doing six by three minutes is a great stimulus for im improvement. But sometimes it's like,
Adam Storey (25:48)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (26:01)
Sometimes you've got to push a stimulus and sometimes you've got to pull. And if you're finding yourself, you've done threshold and threshold and threshold. And that was what that would be where I suggest people start is start with threshold, move into threshold. But so I would start with threshold and tempo, then move into maybe trying two thresholds a week, see how you cope with that. But keep it keep it light. I would keep the total work of the threshold no more than 30 minutes. You know, keep it until and when that starts to stagnate.
Adam Storey (26:27)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (26:31)
the next thing you can do is you can start to kind of increase the total work in those threshold sessions, right? And then when that stag then when that stagnates, then you can look at improving the VO2 max. And that's why it comes back to that point before is it's usually the athletes who have been training have a longer training history are going to probably benefit more from doing the VO2 max sessions.
Adam Storey (26:37)
Yeah, amazing.
Yeah. I mean those those are cool recommendations. And I guess when we when we're talking about this kind of stuff, a lot of athletes will automatically be thinking about run based sessions. But do you want to give us a breakdown in terms of what that would look like and how that would differ potentially being erg based sessions and erg based VO two? Like are we looking to try and hit similar heart rates or is there gonna be a a difference in like cardiac drift occurring on the ergs versus run sessions? So what would athletes need to be mindful of in those those situations?
Dr. Dan Plews (27:22)
Yeah, that's a it's it's a great question. And you should obviously train zones are different for and those intensities are different for ski, row and run. So you need to establish those and Endurox right, we have that five minute test. So the five minute test is establishing a VO two max effort really, but from that we're then pulling we're going we're almost reverse engineering it and establishing a threshold based on that. So but the but the problem I do think that
I mean, I guess it's a little bit of running, but I do like doing threshold sessions on the erg if the th if the individual has the appropriate technique and can manage it. Because if you're someone with a really poor rowing technique and you're you're putting a lot of pressure on your lower back, same for the ski, you gotta be a little bit careful. So I would if you are gonna do threshold sessions for Hyrox the way I do it is I use them as a compliment complementary second session within a threshold day.
Adam Storey (28:21)
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (28:22)
So you might do your threshold
session in the morning. And then if you're a little bit more advanced and you just want to accumulate a few more hours by taking off the mechanical load on the legs, you could do a shorter threshold set, which might just include sixteen minutes of total work. So you're looking at half of what you did in the morning pretty much. But then you can use the ergs to do that. And I think that's a great way to do it. typically typically you're you're looking at like about I think it I think it's approximately
Adam Storey (28:34)
Mm.
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (28:52)
seven to ten seconds less than what you'd hold for a two K is your is your threshold on a ski on a row. So you you're holding that sort of sort of pace. So for me it's like, you know, I'm I'm hold I'm I do a 138 for five minutes. So I'm looking at 148s, 150s on the row is typically what I would hold for that threshold session. But I'd always do them second. And remember that as a second session, I think it's also important to remember that you've got a
when it when it is a second session, you've got to always think about that holy trinity of exercise intensity. So you've got to look at your bit of bit of heart rate, bit of feeling, and a bit of pace because it becomes more important. Because if you're already fatigued for the first session, you do want to be thinking about, you know, making sure that you've got that intensity in check. You don't want to be too hard. Yeah.
Adam Storey (29:26)
Mm.
Hmm, that's
amazing. and just as we record this, it is mid May, which means that we've got world champs coming around the corner. Sort of about six weeks away. which is very exciting. So I I guess what what's but a top of mind for I've had different chats with a number of different athletes around sort of what the next six weeks is gonna look like for them leading into worlds. But I guess, you know, a good chat in general would be about any competition like, you know, and
Dr. Dan Plews (29:52)
How exciting.
Adam Storey (30:08)
This comes to mind like one of my master's students, we're currently doing an injury surveillance study for Hyrox So, you know, what does how does your training influence any injuries that you've received or unfortunately picked up in competition? So one of the questionnaire questions is around tapering. And initially my student got quite in depth in terms of the questions regarding the taper, but then it sort of really, yeah, caught me and made me realize that, hey, you know, a lot of people out there that would be looking to
Dr. Dan Plews (30:30)
yeah.
Adam Storey (30:37)
answer this survey won't actually understand what their taper looks like or what it should look like or maybe understand what these variables mean in a taper. So six weeks out from competition, Dr. Dan Plews like what what's what's some big rocks for you, man? Like what are you looking to lift and shift and to sharpen that sword?
Dr. Dan Plews (30:56)
Yeah,
well, as always, context before content, right? I think one of the first things that I look at is trajectory. So we have any athlete, when you're looking at six weeks is you want to look at that athlete's trajectory. And the worst thing you can do is think that you're so say you've got an athlete who's like on the up and they're just getting better and better and better. The worst thing you can do for that athlete is is change too much and throw more load at them because they're still obviously absorbing and improving from what's been done before. But if you've got quite a stagnant athlete and they're quite stable in their
in the way they're improving, you could definitely do a bit more of an overload block. But the idea is that you want to finish that old overload block within three you've got basically from about three weeks now to do some substantial overload. And the research shows is that with like with training peaks, for example, many people will know what the program training peaks is that we measure something called CTL. And CTL is basically the the average training load or the rolling training load over the last fifty-two days.
think it's fifty two days. and you want to, and the best would be that you want that CTL value to peak around three weeks before competition. You do not want that value to be peaking at competition. If you do that, you get it wrong. So that gives you a little bit of a leeway from now until worlds to do a big block now to try and peak that CTL value and get, you know, which means doing hard training, volume training to try and peak that up. And then
If you can do that, that's the best ti that's that's b the best way that you're gonna give yourself the best chance for the world. But if you're but that's only if you're someone who's stagnated. Like for someone like Dan, for example, I'm gonna we are gonna make very, very small tweaks because he's ha he's on a good projectory at the moment. The worst thing we can do is think, yeah, look at how well he's going now, let's let's do even more training. You know, clearly that's not gonna be the way to do things. It's about thinking keeping things as status quo, but
And for many people it it's a it's a good period to do a bit of an overload for the next next three weeks basically, before you bring it down and start tapering.
Adam Storey (32:55)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent. And I guess I've had a similar conversation on my next question around this with one of my athletes, but also this has sprung to mind going back to my master's students injury surveillance study, because as part of that online questionnaire, we we're asking how many times have you competed prior to your I guess your pinnacle event that we're we're really focusing on. so I guess based on where you are in the world, like some people have really the opportunity to compete.
multiple times like in a in a build up to a competition. So what what's your kind of take on that man? Like in terms of like is there is there too much too much in terms of competition load? Can you compete too much or is there is there benefit in competing quite frequently?
Dr. Dan Plews (33:43)
Yeah, I think it again, I think it's like depends on the athlete. And I've haven't had this conversation before and I get asked this question a lot in triathlon as well. But it it's dependent on a couple of factors. The the main factor is recoverability. So if you have an athlete who can do a Hyrox race and do it well and they can recover fast from it, then there's an athlete who can probably race a little bit more because and it comes back to that CTL value and you can see it with
an athlete who competes too much. Because if you have an athlete who's competing too much, what you typically see is that CTL value, so that chronic train that chronic training load number. So how much the tr how much quality training they're doing over that 50 day period, it will if they're competing too much, it will gradually just drop. Because what happens is they they recover into competition, they do the competition, which is a stimulus, but probably not enough of a stimulus to elicit a big response. They get tired.
They have to not train, they recover, and it takes them too long to recover before they get back to the training. They do another race, so they then get do they do like a week of training. Another race is around the corner. They taper, they recover. A little bit of training. So then you you kind of in this perpetuating like downward spiral. But on the other hand, if you're an athlete who doesn't need a long taper, they can recover in two days. So they just like freshen up really quick. They recover in a day. Those athletes can
get away with it more. But if you're so it's you're talking about the highly aerobically experienced, well trained athletes can race more and get away with it rather than if you're someone new, you probably don't want to be doing as much but you want to be practicing your transitions and your race specific semi s simulation sort of thing more as well as as a as if you're not doing as much racing.
Adam Storey (35:33)
Yeah. Yeah, it is it's a massively fine fine line A. I mean, I I believe like some of the best training is actually competing myself, you know, and I guess I I do preface that with athletes that, you know, you cannot expect to PB every single competition and into a build-up, but you know, treat, you know, this particular competition as maybe a run focused comp or a station focused comp because as much as people love doing sims, you're never ever, ever going to replicate that same kind of
anticipatory heart rate rise that you're getting waiting for that that that start line and or on that start line. So that kind of stuff, even even learning to manage your competition nerves in in the warm up phase, that's a great form of training as well. So I'm I I am a big advocate of of competing weather when the opportunity arises, but granted that, you know, you're not going to taper for every single event, you're not going to P be on every single event, but there will be something that you can you can gain from that even
working on your pre pre morning routine rituals leading into the competition. that kind of stuff is also a consideration.
Dr. Dan Plews (36:34)
And that's the
benefit of working with a good coach, right? Is that like I think the if you can manage if you can manage how you enter the competition with specific goals and you're not just gonna do it as hard as you possibly can, I think that's really good. But like in our in Australasia, we're not really at the privileged position where we can race a lot, really. So it's it's a mute point really because the races are so far between. But I think in Europe, anyone who's listening in Europe
It's quite easy to race every weekend, right? And sometimes three or four times over a weekend. I when I did Melbourne and I raced four times how many times I race? Or I raced three times in Melbourne. It took me a long time to recover from that. Like a lot. And some like you know, the your Charlie Botrilles of the world, he races all the time, like multiple times over the weekend and you know, but he's he's a very upper end elite and he can strong endurance background as well. So so he can cope with it.
Adam Storey (37:05)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (37:31)
But I think it's yeah, it is a it is a fine line and most of the time most of the my answer to many of my ath the athletes in endurox who ask us about racing, is I always encourage them to do it because generally it's hard to do it is hard to do too many, especially in in Australia Australia and New Zealand, right? So
Adam Storey (37:45)
Mm.
Mm mm. Yeah, you know I agree. And what what else is on the mind of of D Plews mate, at the moment? What's
Dr. Dan Plews (37:58)
Well well I think
I think we should talk a little bit about tapering though as we talked about as we as we were in there, as we were in the mix of tapering. yeah, what makes a good taper, I guess. I'm interested to know how do you taper for str for your for strength? If you're like if you're doing a big lift, if you're in a strength training competition. How does that look like? Is it similar? No, no, for a weight lifting competition.
Adam Storey (38:18)
For Hyrox specific.
Yeah. It is it is similar.
Yeah, weightlifting competition. Yeah, I mean it's interesting, Like it's weightlifting, yeah, it's quite a quite a cool example actually. So two different quite distinct philosophies, like East German, all about volume versus Bulgarian, I'll use that as an example. East German, the the Bulgarian method, as mentioned, all about volume. So you can kind of think of it, that would be like your tempo stuff, big on tempo, but you'd never get close really to race pace.
work if you if you use it as a Hyrox analogy. So that kind of structure kind of put a lot of faith that all these reps, all this volume is gonna magically enable you to peak perfectly on the day of competition. So I think that can be quite a hit and miss approach because it requires quite a big strong mental fortitude in terms to be able to do that. No.
Dr. Dan Plews (39:15)
like entering I mean, I couldn't even do it for running. If I if I if I'd done a running race and I knew that I'd been just been running at like four foot and I was expected to do my hyrox at three thirty minutes per K and I'd only been running at four thirties. I don't I don't think my mind could do it. And it i it's even more of a it's even more crazy for weightlifting because it's so you either lift you either do it or there's no like run a bit slower.
Adam Storey (39:27)
Yeah. Crazy, It's crazy. No
Dr. Dan Plews (39:41)
It's either you do it or you don't. Yeah.
Adam Storey (39:41)
Yeah, yeah. You're not gonna muscle through a snatch. So I I guess that
that was a bit of a a a a very broad and brutish kind of description, but it is it is pretty much like that. You may have like a the odd max out session leading into that, but it's it's few and far between versus the Bulgarian style is all about intensity, so almost always working at race pace if you use that Hyrox analogy. So again, you're feeling the intensity, you're feeling that weight. Downside is is it becomes
All that intensity comes at a huge cost, both metabolically but also cognitively. But it does give you the confidence going into competition that you are, you know, you've got that mindset to to approach that bar, handle those nerves and everything. So quite two distinct. My my weightlifting philosophy was finding the sort of middle ground between both. I definitely did a lot more on the intensity side. So because I really appreciated the fact and sort of going back to my commentary around competing as the best.
Dr. Dan Plews (40:26)
Middle ground, yeah.
Adam Storey (40:35)
best form of training and and to a certain degree, mainly around enabling athletes to sort of control their inner self-talk and control how they prepare for competitions. So we used to literally run sort of simulated weightlifting competitions sort of three, four weeks out from a major event. Again, so you're getting the the athletes preparing, feeling what it's like walking up to the bar. But again, like the intensity is is really cranking. We'd even sort of push for
personal best. And sometimes you'd get national records broken in training, you know, two, three weeks out. And sometimes on paper, you're thinking, well, geez, this is this is looking good. but in some instances, you know, that athlete maybe peaked, had peaked a little bit too early, or maybe their nerves got the better of them on competition days. So again, it's pretty classic in terms of just rising up that intensity, dropping the volume down. But what was really interesting as part of my PhD.
You know, I looked at the gene expression changes in weightlifters over different training phases. And it was really cool to see that in some of my weightlifters, based on their genomic responses, they were definitely more suited to maintaining high volumes leading into competition, versus other athletes were more suited to dropping the volume d dramatically, but their intensity, they were better off holding intensity. And
Dr. Dan Plews (42:00)
So what was some of the
what what were you measuring though to do to do there?
Adam Storey (42:05)
Yeah, I mean it was looking at sort of I guess there we looked at changes in their performance, like their competition performance. we're monitoring changes in their their training volume and intensity and well and how that married up to their changes in competition performance, but also the gene expression changes on top of that. So genes that were involved with sort of protein turnover, muscle repair regeneration that w that were had having positive effects, you know, they were
significantly upregulated in response to a good taper versus they were being a little bit blunted in in what was termed like a a taper that wasn't probably suited for them. And I guess generally speaking, what we found is it was a bit of a sex related difference as well. Females tend to re tended to respond better with a higher amount of volume leading into competition versus males again it's you sort of cut that volume, it doesn't really matter.
Dr. Dan Plews (42:35)
Yeah, right.
Adam Storey (42:59)
as long as the intensity is held high. So I guess one one type of
Dr. Dan Plews (43:04)
Sorry, so so
the so the the females responded better to cutting the volume but keeping the intensity high. Opposite other way around. So the ma the males you you so that's that's typical tapering though. Reduced volume, keeping the intensity. But the females you you kept the volume high?
Adam Storey (43:11)
Other way round. Other way around.
Yeah.
had had to keep a little bit of volume in there right up to competition. And I guess one one
Dr. Dan Plews (43:25)
interesting. But the intensity stayed
the same? So it was just so basically you're talking like a so basically you're talking the fifty percent. So say typical taper, you've reduced the ch overall training load by fifty percent, but you keep the intensity distribution the same. so with males you might reduce it by fifty percent, keep the intensity there. With the females you might reduce it by seventy five percent, but you'd you'd keep the same intensity distribution as well. It's just like But were they doing less training generally, or was it the
Like overall.
Adam Storey (43:55)
In terms of frequency?
Dr. Dan Plews (43:57)
In terms of overall volume.
Adam Storey (43:59)
Yes, they were. They were lady Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (44:00)
Yeah. Okay. But like in
general in even an overload period, was that training less than a male's?
Adam Storey (44:06)
the males. yes, yeah, yes, it was, obviously on on absolute, absolute numbers, but relatively it was it was pretty comparable. So the main the main differences and this is this is due to the fact that the level of the cohort, they were all sort of ten ten years plus at the intern international level. They w they were very, very experienced lifters, they could handle that that type of volume, both male and female.
Dr. Dan Plews (44:17)
Yeah yeah.
Yeah yeah yeah.
Adam Storey (44:33)
But yeah, it was just interesting that yeah, the the females having to hold that volume a little bit higher. And, you know, hypothetically or one thing that we we talked about was potentially the need to sort of keep the testosterone levels elevated a little bit more in the females. because again, like obviously females do have naturally circulating testosterone levels and you drop that away and potentially they're they're seeing a a a decrease further in their their natural levels. So
Dr. Dan Plews (44:48)
Yeah, interesting.
I mean the the individualization of I think that's what it comes down to with that we we're going circling back to the VO2 max and the threshold though is that the there's a massive genetic component to the way people respond to training and that this huge individual very very variation. I actually was just writing a blog article that I will put on Endurox that was like comparing Threshold and VO2 max because when I was talking when I knew we were going to be talking a bit about this during, I started looking into it. I'm gonna read this one part of it. I'll read it for betum.
Adam Storey (45:11)
Mm-hmm.
Dr. Dan Plews (45:29)
Because it's quite interesting. It says the he it's from the a study called the Heritage Family Study remains the most rigorous investigation of individual variation in VO2 match response to standardized training. In forty four four hundred and eighty one sedentary adult participants competing in a 21-week program, aerobic training mean VO2 match gain was approximately 400 milliliters per minute. The range stretched from near zero in low responders to over 1,000 milligm milliliters per minute in high responders.
Heterability of VO2 match trainability was estimated up at 47%, with familial aggregation data suggesting that approximately 2.5 times more variance in the training response existed between families than within them. 2.5 times. Isn't that crazy? So, like basically, if you have you know, if you know that you've got a like between families.
Adam Storey (46:13)
Wow. That is crazy.
Dr. Dan Plews (46:22)
Like br well your brothers and you'll you'll respond if you know that you've got a dad or a brother who responds well to a training stimulus, you could probably apply it to a younger sibling and you've got a high chance that it's gonna work. Yeah. Isn't that crazy? So
Adam Storey (46:32)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Just the na natural breeding programs in place,
Dr. Dan Plews (46:40)
Yeah, exactly. But I mean it's the the genetic factors are are huge to the way you respond to training. And also in that in that paper it was like it was another paper that was that came out and it was non responders to a low dose of sixty minutes frequently became responders when the dose was increased from sixty minutes to two hundred and forty minutes per week at the same intensity. So they had this one study that dis basically found all these non responders to training at sixty minutes per week.
gave them more training and they're suddenly responders. So it's all about the dose is the medicine, right? Comes back to the comes back to the same point. And that's my my my same point that comes back before is that when you talk about VO2 match training, you probably need a higher dose as you get as people are getting faster or improving or have a stronger aerobic engine. but to finish the pot off on the tape of things for for Hyrox I think what you talked about
Adam Storey (47:14)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mm.
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (47:38)
In the strength, the same principles apply, right? Definitely. Because a typical taper is seven to 14 days. I think 10 is the sweet spot. That's typical how I'll go for is a 10-day taper. And we're always looking to reduce volume, but keep the intensity the same. So and we typically reduce the volume by about 50% of what you're normally doing. So
Adam Storey (47:42)
Yeah, yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (48:05)
Say in a normal week you're doing eight by four minutes as your threshold set. In a taper week, you'd be doing four by four minutes. But you keep the intensity identical. If you're doing your normal one run in a normal week is 75 minutes, you're basically halving that and doing the same. So you're keeping the intensity, reducing the overall volume, and ideally maintaining the frequency. So if you're doing three sessions a day on a Monday, try and keep three sessions a day on a Monday.
Adam Storey (48:29)
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (48:32)
And it doesn't really matter if it's a linear taper or a stepwise taper. There's no real evidence to suggest that any of them are any better than the other. But you know, I I prefer to do kind of a linear taper that, you know, I do a little bit less as I come towards the racing. And that's what I'll program for most of my athletes. So the day before then, you know, you don't be you there are acute responses to training. So if your race is on a Saturday, you'd only be doing like your four by four minutes the day before. you wanna keep that pretty light. But it's quite
You know, those are j those are the general rules you can can apply.
Adam Storey (49:05)
Yeah, yeah, I agree. And I I think for for coaches out there it it's such a critical conversation to have with your athletes say, like to firstly explain what the taper will look like for them, but also getting their their input into that taper as well because you know, what what do you reckon will feel good for you leaning into that competition because you cannot have case in point going back to that weightlifting example, you cannot have a cookie cutter approach taper for every single athlete and expect it to work, you know.
Dr. Dan Plews (49:33)
Mm. Yeah. I mean, some people like to do a I mean, I was typically someone who did a lot more training in my tape, but when I was talking about my triathlon days, I like to train quite a lot. And one of the reasons I like to do that is because I found it grounded me and I would get quite nervous before racing. And I found that you know, I you almost have a bit of self-doubt that creeps in when you train less. And I found that doing a bit more training would always build my confidence because it was like, you I still am, you you go out and do a session and then you feel good, you still feel in shape. And I think there's a
Adam Storey (49:39)
Yeah.
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (49:59)
There is a psychological component and athletes who are used to training a lot find it hard to not train. I was never very comfortable with almost doing nothing. And I but I have some athletes who almost do zero. Like, you know, they'll do like they just you're talking like 50%, they'll do less than 50%, you're talking 10, 15%, and they thrive off it. They enjoy not doing any training. So it's dependent on the psychology of the athlete.
Adam Storey (50:12)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (50:23)
And for those who are listening, I actually wrote a blog that is available on the Endurox website that is all about this topic of what to do in these final six weeks in the leading to Stockholm. Obviously, you don't have to be racing in Stockholm. It's it can be any race where you've got six weeks to go. But one of the things that the conclusions that I made in that in that article was that yes, what you're doing now is having a big impact. So we talked about increasing that chronic training load and trying to get it peaking three weeks before competition. But that
Adam Storey (50:51)
I mean.
Dr. Dan Plews (50:53)
is the biggest effect is what you're gonna do be doing the taper. The taper has a huge effect on your overall performance. So I think there's like a ten, fifteen percent increase in your performance from when you're in the overload state to your tapered state. it's not like the taper's having a an effect if you're fresh going doing a taper, but if you're very overloaded and you do a taper, you have a massive increase. And that increase is bigger than the fact that you're at a high CTL in three weeks out. So it's definitely something that you really want to dial in and and and get right.
Adam Storey (51:07)
Mm.
Yeah, yeah, I love that. And actually, you know, you're just going back to that heritage study, you you know, you're talking about the the genetics that underlie VO two and training dose responses. But is there any any genetics that predisposing us to better recovery from an endurance perspective?
Dr. Dan Plews (51:43)
Well, don't you think it comes back to what we talked about last week with those wing gates and the I think the main I think the main thing that's affecting recovery mainly is muscle fibre composition and the genetic components associated with that. So have you we y there's an I'm sure there's another paper that looked at the recovery and overload training generally, between fast twitch dominant and slow twitch dominant fibers and you know, you can slow twitch dominant athletes can cope with more training load generally 'cause they recover faster.
Adam Storey (51:47)
Mm.
Mm.
Dr. Dan Plews (52:11)
So I think the most of the genetic components is coming from that. Would what what do you think?
Adam Storey (52:16)
Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean I I agree. I guess from that that strength and power perspective, like as mentioned with my my thesis, I did see differences in, I guess, the the protein synthesis pathways. So there is a bit of a a genetic component and again I I liken those those that weightlifting cohorts almost like Wolverine, you you know, the famous X Men that can actually get destroyed and annihilated and come back and just keep regenerating. So
Dr. Dan Plews (52:30)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, they just recovered.
Adam Storey (52:45)
Yeah, and I I I guess with that stuff there as well, it's bit of a chicken and egg s situation, is like we don't know if these these lifters or these athletes were born with this predisposition or if it's a case of epigenetics where over time just due to that that continuous stimulus that they're getting those those changes in the genomic expression which are now gonna be advantageous to their performance. So Yeah.
Dr. Dan Plews (53:08)
Also, we do know
that over time, like lots of endurance training, you can you can shift some of your muscle fibre types, right? So you can you you shift some of the you can shift some fast twitch to slow twitch and therefore you're going to be coming more towards a slow twitch side. So over time your ability to hold and with and do more training is going to increase, right? Because you are actually having shifts in the muscle fibres as well.
Adam Storey (53:32)
Mm.
Yeah, yeah. Amazing. Amazing.
Dr. Dan Plews (53:36)
No Yeah. All
right, dude, so what are you up to next?
Adam Storey (53:43)
Yeah, well, I mean it's it's honestly for me, I've just got my sights set on Hyrox World Champs coming up. So I'll be heading over there with the Sports Science Advisory Council. We're looking to come together almost like the Avengers and sort of have a chat around sort of what research projects we've got currently on, but also what research projects we'd like to do coming up. But we're also gonna be spending a bit of time with the elite fifteen coaches over there as well, just having a chat around what kind of support.
they may need leading into various competitions with your athletes. So yeah, just looking forward to that, really. What about yourself?
Dr. Dan Plews (54:18)
That's gonna be cool.
That's gonna be cool. I'm off to Kona. Kona on Sunday. Yeah, I'm doing a bit of a training camp with some triathletes there, so that shall be good. but yeah, I forgot you were going to Stockholm as well. You gotta give my 'cause obviously I'm not going now. but we'll get I had a question about that from one of the Endurox athletes in the webinar actually. Was if we were gonna do anything and I totally forgot you were there, so now he can see meet the legendary Adam story. The one and only.
Adam Storey (54:22)
yeah.
It's
Yeah.
Thanks,
mate. Thanks for forgetting about me. That's all right. tell tell us more about Kona mate. That's gonna be exciting.
Dr. Dan Plews (54:48)
Ha ha ha
Yeah, well it's kind of half family, half holiday. so so half ho sorry, half work, half holiday. So we've got one of my one on one tri athletes and we're doing a bit of a camp there, training for Kona. Well the families are coming too, so it's kind of a bit above, but it would be it's gonna be a nice break. It's gonna be good. Yeah. All right, dude. Well everyone, do check out Endurox seven days for free as well. Do check out the training programmes if you liked anything you're here h here here today, let us know.
Adam Storey (55:11)
Amazing.
Dr. Dan Plews (55:23)
And we will actually you'll probably do some QA's, shouldn't we? That would be good one day. I think my next Yeah, q we should open the floor to some Q Q and A. So I think the next one we're gonna try and get on a guest. And I'm thinking the one and only Sam Purchase. What'd you reckon? Yeah, I reckon that'd be good. Yeah, we we talked force velocity profiles. Can you and you can you I mean you're the guru and we'll have him on as like
Adam Storey (55:29)
We should. We should actually. Yeah.
Perfect. We'll lock in. We can afford
Look at her movie.
Dr. Dan Plews (55:52)
You know, the ma the man behind behind the guru.
Adam Storey (55:55)
Yeah.
Me being a supervisor. That's all right. No no paranoids.
Dr. Dan Plews (55:59)
No, he'll be he'll be
qu he'll be he'll be quivering. Quivering with you being being there. Making sure he says the right thing. You know it, Sam. All right, mate, we'll catch you soon.
Adam Storey (56:11)
Catch yeh man.
